PVP Could Use a Minimum Level Requirement

Since free access happened, PVP has been filled with brand new players. There were several times over the weekend where I loaded into game with 3 other players who were all level 1. Consistently my groups are filled with new players under level 20 with no gems and with just primitive gear (though no digs against primitive gear.) These groups are constantly getting wrecked in PVP because the players don't know what they're doing, and, without gems, they are somewhat under-powered. As the masses of new players get destroyed in PVP, there are outcries of "Veil Demon is way too OP," when many of these players should probably just spend some time learning the game, unlocking spells, and gaining gold for a gem or two.

It's gotten pretty frustrating. I really liked Breach when I started playing a month ago, but the influx of new and inexperienced players right into PVP has pretty much ruined the experience for me. Don't get me wrong, I'm not God's gift to Breach and I'm just mediocre at this game, but it's just not fun getting teamed up with very new players every single game.

I think the game needs some sort of level restriction in order to play PVP. I don't know exactly what the level number should be, but I think players need to have put some time into learning the game and developing their characters before entering PVP.

I know the game is someday headed for F2P and needed to see how things would be with the free access, but the current state of PVP isn't fun. For me, the influx of free access players is going to chase me away. I rather liked this game, but now it's not worth jumping into queues knowing how it's going to turn out. I'm going to save myself further frustration and take an extended break from the game.


  • I hear you but I don't agree with locking P2P for new players. I think these are two main problems with the current pvp system:

    1. High Level Players getting matched with Low Level Players
      -Can be fixed by adjusting matchmaking system to take player level into account and balance accordingly.

    2. PvP is all Ranked

      • Add a non rank pvp mode
    3. Solo players and Parties both que in Rank, therefore it's more easy for people to rank with a party than solo players.

    • Make the pvp have a separate solo and party que

    However I don't know if these obvious solutions will be implemented just yet because currently they might not be effective due to the small player base.

  • We've actually made adjustments to matchmaking with our update on the 26th that specifically addresses some of the issues here. Our goal is to always maintain fairness in matchmaking.

    We should also note that you can technically be a level 100+ and have a terrible ELO if you play a lot, and lose just as much. Level is not always a separation, but I agree that it oftentimes is.

  • @OneLetter said:
    We've actually made adjustments to matchmaking with our update on the 26th that specifically addresses some of the issues here. Our goal is to always maintain fairness in matchmaking.

    We should also note that you can technically be a level 100+ and have a terrible ELO if you play a lot, and lose just as much. Level is not always a separation, but I agree that it oftentimes is.

    It's not really a matchmaking issue. I realize level and ELO are independent, but what I'm looking for is something that prepares new players and their characters better for PVP. If you look at when medic was added, many experienced players took their brand new medics to PVE in order to learn the character and unlock the skills. The point I'm going for is that level 1 new players in PVP creates a very unbalanced game.

    Maybe the game could guide players a little better on their journey from level 1 newbie to PVP contender. Maybe once a player reaches level 5 they earn a free red gem, at level 10 they earn a free class from the school of their existing character, at level 15 they get a blue gem, and at level 20 they can play in PVP. Those levels could be changed to 3,6,9, and 12 for all I care; what I'm most concerned about is that level 1s shouldn't be jumping into PVP as soon as they download the game.

    PVE is where people learn a new class and unlock skills. Experienced players realize this and many use PVE when a new class like medic comes out. Experienced players also realize the strength in combining spells from within a school, and they would also recommend having gems equipped if you're going to play PVP. It should not be unreasonable to have brand new players learn and develop their characters at least for a little while in PVE before progressing to PVP.

  • edited March 5

    I strongly believe a better tutorial would be beneficial overall. The current tutorial is more of an FPS tutorial and even some of those games that have some in depth mechanics also have more in depth tutorials. Do some of these new players even know there is gear or gems that can effect the playability of a hero to varying degrees of "wow!"? How about skill swap between same school heroes?

    As someone that did...0 research into this game and saw a single video about it and got sold on the veil demon aspect, I knew NOTHING about skill swap until someone mentioned needing to level a hero which lead to "whats the point of leveling heroes? does it improve their stats or something?" and then an explanation in general chat regarding skill swap.

    Tutorial rundown (example)
    Step #1 - They have made their avatar appearance and are now looking at the starting hero selection, they get to pick one, yay!
    Step #2 - the current move, attack, use skill, open crate tutorial
    Step #4 - Showing them hero sheet in Character tab and explaining how gear effects talents which are available during missions
    Step #5 - Explaining how you can use 400g to upgrade a character in a particular way that effects the ability to not suck (GEMS)
    Step #6 - Tell them to go play a solo v AI game (LOCK OTHER OPTIONS!)
    Step #7 - Coop vs AI...PVP STILL LOCKED
    Step #8 - Hit level 10 (its not hard, 1 victory match of Coop vs AI is like 3 levels with starting booster with a fresh hero, so could just pick starter+ freebie bought or weeklies and hit 12 in 4 or 5 matches which also nets you 400g~ for a gem, amazing!)
    Step #9 - Promptly inform them how weaksauce they are compared to longer term players just based on gear/gems so unless they are awesome, stay away from PvP for a little bit until they get some gems and gear. Also promptly remind them that all children are amazing in the eyes of non-drunk abusive parents, so take that "Amazing!" from mom with a grain of salt...scratch the grain of salt most wont understand it, but something easily understandable to them.
    Step #10 - Cut em loose but have the option to replay the tutorial steps 4-10 with skill swap explanation glued in somewhere.
    Step #2.5 (just thought of it! so edit) - While doing the basic movement and such tutorial, also put in simple explanations about mission objects. Like how capture the signal thingies doesnt give enough time for one by one or how picking up the shiny lights and feeding the flying drone is good. Dont forget to donate the purple rock to the drone scholar (3 times!)

    Honestly think of gamers as children with little to no ability to do for themselves. The badass competitive gamers go in and figure out things like its their job (oh wait, it is) while use normal folk or subpar folk (think i fit there better tbh) need things pointed out to us...sometimes daily for a few days too.

    Is it more work for you devs? yeah, it is, sorry about that but if you can lure in and properly train the monkeys, sooner or later they will throw money at you (and verbal feces, sorry. Internet + ability to voice opinion tends to breed toxicity of varying levels).

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